[dojutsu]

Now forgive me because i know hardly anything about japanese martial arts, but i decided to start reading into them out of curiousity.

I saw a brief mention on sutemi waza, or the "self-sacrifice"throw (or something like that) and it basically said that it places the user in a "disadvantagous" position after the throw. Is this strictly true?

Now having not seen any sutemi waza throws, and as i dont know anyone into the japanese arts, i was wondering what use anyone on here found for such a type of throw.

Is it a good set up for groundwork or something?

[Tease T Tickle]

They're "sacrifice" throws because the throwing motion requires nage to fall onto their own back. If uke is skilled enough, he can land in such a way that he will land on top of nage for ne waza, or in sport judo, so that uke receives the score for the throw. Depending on the school, there's roughly 20 of these throws and they range from incredibly similar to western wrestling suplexes to the distinctively Japanese tomoe nage.

[bamboo]

Interesting that you chose a distinctly japanese flavoured name if your not much into the japanese influenced arts.

-bamboo

[samurai6string]

tomoe nage=my favorite throw of all time. I also like to go from a "failed" tomoe nage into a triangle choke by wrapping with the outstretched leg.

Another "sacrifice" throw that I liked, but can't remember the Japanese for, was something we sometimes refered to as the "Baseball slide" throw. I'm sure you can imagine how that one is executed.

[dojutsu]

Well my name really came around when i first started getting into asian culture in general, and i was attracted to the Japanese language. My name is a botched creation from unreliable translations that i thought meant something like "The way of martial method", or "the way- martial method". Its probably nothing like that in actual translation but i liked the ring to "dojustu" after a while

I had also seen a Japanese Ju Jutsu demonstration by people who ran a club that I wanted to join like you wouldnt believe. But i got the wrong information from a friend regarding where the classes were run and never found the place lol!

That was before i even knew there was different styles of JJJ

Ive managed to find loads of connections to kung fu classes in my local area, so ive been pretty emmersed in that for a while. Still want to find that JuJutsu class...

[dojutsu]

Also i heard about this Bujinkan Taijutsu place that isnt EXTREMELY far from me, and i saw the sticky thread about it in the japanese MA section.

Yet i hear random whisperings about frauds (who is this Hayes guy?) linked to Ninpo in general, and ive noticed that a significant few have broken away from Bujinkan to start there own thing (Jinenkan, BBD, Genbukan, and i think thats it). So whats the story there? Bujinkan isnt some elaborate Shaolin do-esque oraganisation that fools people 'til there in the "upper-dan" area is it lol?!?!?

[bamboo]

My favourite is sutemi sumi Otoshi or sacrifice corner drop

[buicken]

Baseball slide = yoko wakare ?
http://www.judoinfo.com/images/anima...yokowakare.htm

[zefff]

Nice one Buiken. Thanks for that.

[Tease T Tickle]

Originally Posted by dojutsu

Yet i hear random whisperings about frauds (who is this Hayes guy?) linked to Ninpo in general, and ive noticed that a significant few have broken away from Bujinkan to start there own thing (Jinenkan, BBD, Genbukan, and i think thats it). So whats the story there?

Hayes is an American who studied through the Bujinkan organization and then started his own school. Just like every other ninjutsu school out there, Hayes claims to have an excellent pedigree of instruction. In the case of Hayes, the origin of the pedigree isn't the controversy, it's the extent. I don't know off hand about the other organizations, but generally speaking they were high level Bujinkan guys who broke away for political or financial reasons (read, selfishness). I won't comment on 'frauds' in the sense of McDojos because the entire list of ninjutsu organizations has been suspect at some time or another and they don't engender themselves well to external examination.

Bujinkan isnt some elaborate Shaolin do-esque oraganisation that fools people 'til there in the "upper-dan" area is it lol?!?!?

That depends on how you define 'fool.' If you imply that they string you along and full your head with mush simply to make a buck, generally no. They take themselves seriously and present themselves with dignity, they are not charlatans with black belts simply trying to rip you off. If you imply that their genuine teaching is of little value, well, you might be right. It depends on a lot of factors, not the least of which is what you want in a martial art.