[zefff]

Originally Posted by The BadBoy

So what does a Wing Chun School taht teaches functionality look like? You know of any? If so do they have a web address?

The school Im in now does have a poor web presence but sadly it is ill-conceived and aimed at the type of person I described before and so too is the open class curriculum at present.

The rawest WC school Ive attended has never had a website but is well known to the hardcore. Ive some good things about these guys though although Ive never seen it. http://www.kamonwingchun.com/

Originally Posted by The BadBoy

Where I disagree with how things are taught is that you can minimise being hit. I do not feel that schools teach beginners enough about defence so that they aren't afraid to get hit. What they get taught is a load of nonsense that will not aid them and that is why I feel that a lot of places concentrate on teaching hitting first.

By "a lot of places" do you mean general MA or actual WC? Trust me most WC schools (based on my meetings with students) focus on parries and defences before attacks.

Maybe we are not conveying what we are talking about well enough. I think I get you now. It is the defensive techniques themselves that are in question!

So lets take a technique you believe to work, how about an absorption block where you take a right cross and difuse the force on your bent forearms/bicep with a slight roll of the waist.

For self defence applications would you rather learn that technique first to avoid being hit or would you rather learn to step across to the outside and fire your own right cross from inside their angle of attack?

Both have their plus and minus' but I would rather learn to strike hard first myself. For me, good attacking seems to teach me a lot about my body and how it moves. Good defences seem to increase my brain power though as I link it all together off of those....who knows maybe Im chatting rubbish.

[peajay]

I'm not about to say what school I go to... as a mere student I cannot dream to try and represent their teaching ethos. As such my own naivety may lead me to state things from my perspective that the Sifu doesn't actually mean. I can give people the web address of my school in pm, on the understanding that it's for info, and anything I say here is my opinion...

Now, legal and moral bumph out the way...

We work on teaching the concept that a block is an attack. The arm positions are the same.. the hand shape on the end may be different.

Using Zefffs example, this right cross, block with a pac sau, or fuc sau but that block is also an attack (i say these terms, but they are principles, not fixed shapes/positions). One of the things we are working on now is getting through your attackers fence. So, as my Sifu says, we don't fight, by matching what the attackers stance, they are then dictating the fight and would probably would beat us... If you defend an attack, the only way to win is to then step in and fight as a WC person. So, block that punch, but use that block as the launch of your attack.

Some of our current work is all about attacks... but to block the first punch then blast through the attack, step into the attackers space and fight with WC. Some of it gets quite punchy, with pads, gloves and sometimes face masks...

I may have not described it well... but my thrust is that we do both defence and attack work all the time, one is the same as the other

[zefff]

I get what your saying and that is all good, now what I am saying is that when the punch comes instead of the rear hand parry you could use your own punch to jam the attackers punch off line - basically punch through or over his punch....Or you could just beat him to the punch.

Nothing is bad as long as we punch the man in his face while avoiding his attack; even if we look like shit while doing it.

[peajay]

Originally Posted by zefff

I get what your saying and that is all good, now what I am saying is that when the punch comes instead of the rear hand parry you could use your own punch to jam the attackers punch off line - basically punch through or over his punch....Or you could just beat him to the punch.

Nothing is bad as long as we punch the man in his face while avoiding his attack; even if we look like shit while doing it.

Aahhh...
yes, I agree, the block is actually a strike - yes, we train to do this, but at times its easier to stick in the block first...
Though my Sifu does say to get your retaliation in first, that way you dont have to deal with the first hit.

[zefff]

There are no blocks in WC, only parries.

[peajay]

Zefff, I agree... I was using block in an example of loosely defined language... I would agree that all WC parries, could actually be strikes, similarly, the structure of a strike means that you are also parrying counter strikes too...

Latest update - Now there are three. We have talked my daughter (15) into coming along to WC with us. This, in my opinion, can only be a good thing...

We were working against "boxers" last season, how to get in close, do nasty things to their wrist, then keep coming until you’re within WC range and splat them... lol. Of course that is the theory…

I find that despite being, what I thought co-ordinated and in charge of all my faculties, WC is setting new standards in multi-tasking… Being able to stand, sinking into the stance, moving your feet (ha! moving at all), and then co-ordinating two arms, doing two things, oh and for Pete’s sake RELAX, such a challenge! I should have been female!

[The BadBoy]

You were working against boxers?

Did you spar with any boxers who have spent a reasonable amount of time in a boxing gym? If not, I'm afraid your efforts where probably wated.

[peajay]

Originally Posted by The BadBoy

You were working against boxers?

Did you spar with any boxers who have spent a reasonable amount of time in a boxing gym? If not, I'm afraid your efforts where probably wated.

If you take the whole thread as a whole, you'll see i'm more than a little green round the edges in this art.. but i'm an enthusiast, and i do know my limitations... So, note the quotes in my original post... No, i dont think i'd last 2 seconds against a proper fighter. - the idea i was trying (badly i admit) to get over, without saying that i'm now some kind of expert... was that one is likely to meet people who will have a certain stance, guard, way of holding themselves... The idea is to work round that and not to try and match what they are doing, but defend oneself in a WC way...

stick it up, and it gets shot off...

[The BadBoy]

What I'm trying to say is that if your working to do wing chun against boxers then you need boxers o do wing chun against. You can't mimic a boxer and say its boxing. How many different boxers are there. some are orthodox, some southpaw, some prefer a convemtional stance, others the philly shell. Some only attack on the counter, other wll charge at you like rinos. Get my drift?

[dscott]

Originally Posted by The BadBoy

others the philly shell.

???????????